Quote Investigator® – Tracing Quotations

Quote Origin: Old Age and Treachery Will Always Defeat Youth and Skill

Waylon Jennings? P.J. O’Rourke? David Mamet? Johnny Rutherford? Jerry Schofield? Fausto Coppi? Anonymous?

**Illustration of a checkmate from Pixabay**

Question for Quote Investigator: Physical abilities decline with age, but experience accumulates. The following adage is popular with feisty seniors:

Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill.

This saying has been attributed to singer-songwriter Waylon Jennings, playwright David Mamet, political commentator P. J. O’Rourke, race car driver Johnny Rutherford, and others. Would you please explore the provenance of this expression?

Reply from Quote Investigator: The earliest close match known to QI appeared in the “Beaumont Journal” of Beaumont, Texas on July 21, 1975. A columnist wrote about the retirement of Jerry Schofield who was the newspaper’s national advertising manager. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

Jerry doesn’t look his 65 years. But as he grew older he came more and more to treasure this motto prominently displayed in his office: “Old age and treachery will always defeat youth and skill.”

The phrasing suggested that the message was on display for an extended period before the article was written. Schofield is currently the top candidate creator for this motto. Although it remains possible that he was simply repeating an existing saying with an anonymous origin.

The genesis of this saying was lengthy. Phrases of this general type have occurred often during the past one hundred years. Yet, these precursors were not presented in proverbial form. Also, they did not achieve precise wide repetition. Some statements used interrogative form. Here is an overview with dates and ascriptions:

1910: Will experience and brains defeat youth and energy? (Sports journalist Dick Jemison)

1915: Experienced fighters … utilize vast knowledge to overcome youth and strength (Anonymous)

1922: The warfare of youth and love and honor and courage against age and treachery and hypocrisy and mystery (Book reviewer John Clair Minot)

1923: Proved the superiority … of age and intellect over youth and skill (Anonymous)

1925: The ability of age and experience to defeat youth and endurance (Sports journalist Robert Edgren)

1929: How to defeat youth with experience (Anonymous)

1938: The splendid victory of youth and love over age and treachery (Author Louis Arthur Cunningham)

1964: Can age and experience beat youth and enthusiasm? (Anonymous)

Below is an overview of the adage under examination. These entries include dates and attributions for close matches in proverbial form:

1975 Jul 21: Old age and treachery will always defeat youth and skill (Motto displayed in the office of Jerry Schofield)

1975 Jul 22: Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill (Spoken by Wayne Dollick)

1977: Old age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill (Sign displayed in the office of Joseph Mastroianni)

1978: Age and treachery will win over youth and skill (Credited to a friend of NASCAR driver Hershel McGriff)

1979: Age, cunning, deceit and treachery can defeat youth and skill (Message on a T-shirt sold by John George)

1979: Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill (Bohor’s Bromide in the book “1,001 Logical Laws”)

1982: Old age and trickery will overcome youth and skill (Motto for cross-stitch pattern)

1984: Experience and treachery will beat youth and enthusiasm (Labeled an “old saying” by race car driver Johnny Rutherford)

1986: Age and guile beats youth and talent every time (Announcer Don Davis)

1988: Age and treachery overcomes youth and exuberance (Curler Lil Werenka)

1991: Old age and treachery always overcomes youth and skill (Lyric in a song by Waylon Jennings and Willie Nelson)

1995: Age and Guile Beat Youth, Innocence, and a Bad Haircut (Book title by P. J. O’Rourke)

2009: Age and treachery will overcome youth and skill (Attributed to Fausto Coppi)

2015: Old age and treachery will always beat youth and exuberance (Attributed to David Mamet)

Below are details for selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: I Don’t Get Heart Attacks, I Give Them

Rex Harrison? Ian Sinclair? Harry Cohn? Kenneth R. Smith? Marie Michael? Terry Goodkind? Anonymous?

**Picture of a heart in neon from Unsplash**

Question for Quote Investigator: A powerful person once delivered a line that vividly combined anger and arrogance. After the individual harshly scolded an underling, an assistant said that the incessant episodes of rage might lead to a heart attack. The reply was sharp:

I don’t get heart attacks. I give them.

This statement has been attributed to English actor Rex Harrison, Canadian railway executive Ian Sinclair, movie mogul Harry Cohn, and others. Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: The earliest match for the heart attack quip found by QI appeared in 1951. An anonymous executive with the generic name “Brown” delivered the line. The tale appeared in “The Agricultural Education Magazine”. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

And then I told him the old story of the executive in a manufacturing concern who was giving one of his foremen a dressing down over the telephone for not turning out greater production from his department. A visitor was at the desk of the manufacturer and listened to the driving conversation.

When the receiver was hung up, the visitor remarked, “Mr. Brown, if you do that very often you are going to get a heart attack.” The irate manufacturer’s reply was, “I don’t get heart attacks, I give them.”

This quip is part of a family. Here are three examples:

(1) I don’t get ulcers. I give them.
(2) I don’t get heart attacks, I give them.
(3) I don’t have nightmares. I give them.

The earliest match in this family found by QI referred to ulcers. An unnamed egotistical Hollywood producer delivered the line according to gossip columnist Jimmie Fidler in March 1947:²

Seems one of his employes, after listening to the big shot administer a fifteen-minute tongue-lashing to an assistant, ventured one solicitous remark. “You shouldn’t let yourself become so excited,” he warned. “You’re liable to get stomach ulcers.” “I don’t get ulcers,” roared the mighty one, “I give them!”

A separate article about the ulcer quip is available here.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: Everyone Told Us MTV Wouldn’t Last. As It Turns Out, They Were Right

Martha Quinn? Tom Freston? Judy McGrath? Apocryphal?

**Singer shown in silhouette from Unsplash**

Question for Quote Investigator: When MTV (music television) launched in 1981 numerous commentators were skeptical of its viability. Yet, the channel has persevered for decades. One of the early VJs (video jockeys) recalled the initial uncertainty, but the VJ added a twist with the following remark:

Everybody said MTV wouldn’t last. Well, they were right!

The channel has now become unrecognizable. Reality TV shows are highlighted, and music is almost an afterthought. The old MTV is gone. I do not recall the exact phrasing of this remark. Nor do I know who said it. Would you please help me to explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: In 2013 a group of VJs published the book “VJ: The Unplugged Adventures of MTV’s First Wave”. Martha Quinn stated the following:¹

In the beginning, everyone told us MTV wouldn’t last. As it turns out, they were right—our MTV doesn’t exist anymore. There’s no videos on the channel now: It’s Jersey Shore and Teen Mom and My Super Sweet 16.

Quinn continued with a melancholy anecdote about the format change:

Recently, I was shopping at my local farm stand, and the farmer introduced me to a teenage girl. He told her, “This is Martha Quinn—she used to be on MTV.” She said, “Really? What show?”

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Dialogue Origin: “Will Computers Ever Be as Smart as Humans?” “Yes, But Only Briefly”

Vernor Vinge? Samuel Butler? Luke Muehlhauser? Anna Salamon? Anders Sandberg? Apocryphal?

**Abstract illustration of AI from Unsplash**

Question for Quote Investigator: Current commentators are preoccupied with guessing when artificial intelligence (AI) systems will achieve human-level intelligence, but a thoughtful science fiction author crafted the following edifying dialogue:

“Will computers ever be as smart as humans?”
“Yes, but only briefly.”

The author suggested that the advancement of AI systems would not pause; instead, systems would rapidly achieve superhuman intelligence and continue ascending toward human incomprehensibility. Would you please help me to find the author’s name together with a citation.

Reply from Quote Investigator: In 2008 prize-winning science fiction author Vernor Vinge published “Signs of the Singularity” in the journal “IEEE Spectrum”. Vinge discussed the implications of AI:¹

The consequences of creating human-level artificial intelligence would be profound, but it would still be explainable to present-day humans like you and me.

But what happens a year or two after that? The best answer to the question, “Will computers ever be as smart as humans?” is probably “Yes, but only briefly.”

For most of us, the hard part is believing that machines could ever reach parity. If that does happen, then the development of superhuman performance seems very likely—and that is the singularity. In its simplest form, this might be achieved by “running the processor clock faster” on machines that were already at human parity. I call such creatures “weakly superhuman,” since they should be understandable if we had enough time to analyze their behavior.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: If You Would Know What the Lord God Thinks of Money, You Have Only to Look at Those to Whom He Gives It

Dorothy Parker? Martin Luther? Jonathan Swift? Alexander Pope? Anne Marsh-Caldwell? Matthew Poole? Richard Steele? Thomas Guthrie? Austin O’Malley? Maurice Baring?

**Illustration of a cascade of money from Pixabay**

Question for Quote Investigator: A scathing comment about wealthy people has been attributed to the U.S. writer Dorothy Parker:

If you would know what the Lord God thinks of money, you have only to look at those to whom he gives it.

Similar comments have been credited to German theologian Martin Luther, Anglo-Irish satirist Jonathan Swift, and English poet Alexander Pope. I do not know whether any of these attributions are correct because I am having difficulty finding solid citations. Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: An interview with Dorothy Paker appeared in “The Paris Review” in 1956. Parker employed the quotation under examination; however, she credited the statement to the English man of letters Maurice Baring. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

I hate almost all rich people, but I think I’d be darling at it. At the moment, however, I like to think of Maurice Baring’s remark: “If you would know what the Lord God thinks of money, you have only to look at those to whom he gives it.” I realize that’s not much help when the wolf comes scratching at the door, but it’s a comfort.

A version of the saying did appear in Maurice Baring’s 1927 novel “Tinker’s Leave”; however, the character who delivered the line credited Jonathan Swift:²

“Do you remember what Swift said?” asked Troumestre: “‘One has only to look at the people God has given money to, to see what He thinks of it.’”

This harsh criticism of affluent individuals has been expressed in numerous ways during the past five centuries. Below is an overview with attributions and dates:

1566: Our Lord God commonly giveth Riches to such gross Asses, to whom hee affordeth nothing else that is good (Martin Luther; Published in German in 1566; English in 1659)

1696: God commonly throws away Riches upon the basest of men (Matthew Poole)

1710: We may learn the little Value of Fortune by the Persons on whom Heaven is pleased to bestow it (Richard Steele)

1720: If heaven had looked upon riches to be a valuable thing, it would not have given them to such a scoundrel (Jonathan Swift)

1727: We may see the small value God has for Riches, by the People he gives them to (Alexander Pope)

1848: Our Lord God commonly gives riches to those from whom he withholds spiritual good (Martin Luther; Alternative English Translation)

1851: God would mark his contempt of mere material riches by the hands into which he suffers them to fall (Attributed to an old divine by Anne Marsh-Caldwell)

1860: We see what God Almighty thinks of riches by the people to whom he gives them (Attributed to Jonathan Swift)

1861: You may know how little God thinks of money by observing on what bad and contemptible characters he often bestows it (Thomas Guthrie)

1915: It was a poor man that said God shows His contempt for wealth by the kind of persons He selects to receive it (Austin O’Malley)

1927: One has only to look at the people God has given money to, to see what He thinks of it (Attributed to Jonathan Swift by a character in a novel by Maurice Baring)

1956: If you would know what the Lord God thinks of money, you have only to look at those to whom he gives it (Attributed to Maurice Baring by Dorothy Parker)

Here are details for selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: The Only Difference Between Me and a Madman Is That I Am Not a Madman

Salvador Dali? Leonard Lyons? Apocryphal?

**Surrealist picture with a digital watch (Public domain)**

Question for Quote Investigator: Two very different statements about madness have been attributed to the famous Spanish surrealist artist Salvador Dali:

(1) The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not a madman.

(2) There is only one difference between a madman and me. The madman thinks he is sane. I know I am mad.

I have not been able to find solid citations for either of these remarks. Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: The earliest match located by QI appeared in 1934 within a Springfield, Massachusetts newspaper which reported on a visit Salvador Dali made to Hartford, Connecticut. The paper stated that Dali spoke “Catalan French”, but the paper presented his words in English. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

He was, he explained, recreating dreams, so that one could see them in the midst of every-day objects. The world that he is investigating is the world Freud wrote of.

“The only difference between me and a madman,” he remarked calmly, “is that I am not a madman. I am able to distinguish between the dream and the real world.”

Salvador Dali died in 1989. The earliest match QI has found for the second statement in the inquiry occurred in 1994. Thus, the evidence supporting the second statement is weak.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: It Is Better To Be Vaguely Right Than Exactly Wrong

John Maynard Keynes? Francis Bacon? Ian Dishart Suttie? Carveth Read? Curt John Ducasse? Gerald F. Shove? H. Wildon Carr?

**Graph of an upward sweeping curve from Pixabay**

Question for Quote Investigator: Two seemingly contradictory adages have become popular:

(1) It is better to be vaguely right than exactly wrong
(2) It is better to be definitely wrong than vaguely right

The justification for the first adage is: A vaguely right answer is valuable because it provides a starting point that can be refined and improved over time to obtain a more accurate answer. However, an exactly wrong answer provides no insight and is misleading.

The justification for the second adage is: A definitely wrong answer is valuable because it can be detected. This recognition of failure forces creative thought to formulate new ideas and construct new answers enabling progress. However, a vaguely right answer encourages the lazy acceptance and the persistence of faulty incoherent ideas.

The first adage has been attributed to English economist John Maynard Keynes, but I have never seen a solid citation. The second adage has been credited to Scottish psychiatrist Ian Dishart Suttie, but I am skeptical. Would you please explore the provenance of these two adages?

Reply from Quote Investigator: Tracing these dual notions is difficult because they can be expressed in numerous ways. Below is an overview depicting the evolution of these sayings with attributions and dates. The statement from Francis Bacon is a precursor for the second adage:

1620: Citius emergit Veritas ex errore quam ex confusion (Francis Bacon)

1620: Truth emerges more readily from error than confusion (Francis Bacon rendered into English)

1898: It is better to be vaguely right than exactly wrong (Carveth Read)

1903: To be only vaguely right is worse than being definitely wrong (Unknown person with initials A. J. O.)

1929: Greater service to the cause of philosophical truth is ever done by being definitely wrong than by being vaguely right (Curt John Ducasse)

1933: It is better to be definitely wrong than vaguely right (Ian D. Suttie)

1936: Mandeville, Malthus, Gesell and Hobson … preferred to see the truth obscurely and imperfectly rather than to maintain error, reached … on hypotheses inappropriate to the facts (John Maynard Keynes)

1942: It is better to be vaguely right than precisely wrong (Attributed to Wildon Carr by Gerald Shove)

1955: It was better to be roughly right than precisely wrong (K. Smith)

1960: I would prefer to be vaguely right than precisely wrong (Sydney J. Harris)

1966: It is better to be vaguely right than precisely wrong (Attributed to John Maynard Keynes in “The Accountants Digest”)

1969: It is better to be vaguely right than precisely wrong (Attributed to John Maynard Keynes by Howard Ross)

1978: It is far better to be clearly and definitely wrong than to be vaguely and indefinitely right (J. Lorne McDougall)

1979: It is better to be precisely wrong than roughly accurate (Edmond A. Murphy)

2009: It was better to be vaguely right than precisely wrong (Attributed to John Maynard Keynes by Anthony Hilton)

Here are details for selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: Money Cannot Buy Health, But I’d Settle for a Diamond-Studded Wheelchair

Dorothy Parker? Evan Esar? Barry Day? Apocryphal?

**Picture of six diamonds from Unsplash**

Question for Quote Investigator: The notable wit Dorothy Parker suffered from ill-health in her later years. She has been credited with the following remark:

Money cannot buy health. but I’d settle for a diamond-studded wheelchair.

I have not been able to find any solid citations, and I have become skeptical. What do you think?

Reply from Quote Investigator: The earliest match found by QI appeared in “The Liverpool Echo” of Merseyside, England in January 1959 within a column titled “Echoes and Gossip of the Day” which contained miscellaneous short items. A title appeared above the quotation. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

Settling Up
Money can’t buy health. but I’d settle for a diamond-studded wheelchair. —Dorothy Parker.

Parker died in 1967; hence, this attribution occurred while she was still alive, but no source was specified.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Dialogue Origin: “Young People, Nowadays, Imagine That Money Is Everything” “Yes, and When They Grow Older They Know It”

Oscar Wilde? Henry Wotton? Sibyl Vane? Louis T. Stanley? Apocryphal?

Question for Quote Investigator: The famous wit Oscar Wilde has received credit for the following cynical dialogue, but I am not sure where it appeared:

“Young people, nowadays, imagine that money is everything.”
“Yes, and when they grow older they know it.”

Oscar Wilde has also received credit for the following quotation which has a very similar meaning:

When I was young I used to think that money was the most important thing in life. Now that I am old, I know it is.

I have become skeptical of these attributions. Are either of these quotations authentic? Did Oscar Wilde repeat the same joke? Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: Oscar Wilde published the novel “The Picture of Dorian Gray” in 1891. During a scene in chapter three the jaded and hedonistic character Lord Wotton (Henry Wotton) met with his uncle Lord Fermor (George Fermor) and discussed money. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

“Money, I suppose,” said Lord Fermor, making a wry face. “Well, sit down and tell me all about it. Young people, nowadays, imagine that money is everything.”

“Yes,” murmured Lord Henry, settling his buttonhole in his coat; “and when they grow older they know it. But I don’t want money. It is only people who pay their bills who want that, Uncle George, and I never pay mine.”

Thus, Oscar Wilde should be credited with this dialogue; however, the acerbic rejoinder was spoken by a fictional character and not by Wilde himself.

QI conjectures that the second quotation in the inquiry was not written or spoken by Oscar Wilde; instead, it was derived from the first quotation via a faulty memory. Wilde died in 1900, and the earliest close match for the second quotation found by QI appeared in 1945.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Quote Origin: Language Is the Mother, Not the Handmaiden of Thought

W. H. Auden? Karl Kraus? Anonymous?

Question for Quote Investigator: Philosophers and scientists are still trying to elucidate the interconnectedness of thought and language. The advent of large language models in artificial intelligence has highlighted this conundrum. One literary figure emphasized the primacy of language with the following adage:

Language is the mother, not the handmaiden of thought.

This statement has been attributed to British-American poet W. H. Auden and Austrian writer Karl Kraus. Yet, I have not seen any solid citations. Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: The earliest match known to QI appeared in 1909 within the Vienna periodical “Die Fackel” (“The Torch”) which published a set of aphorisms crafted by Karl Kraus. The following item was included. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

Die Sprache ist die Mutter, nicht die Magd des Gedankens.

Hear is one possible translation into English:

Language Is the Mother, Not the Handmaiden of Thought.

QI believes this saying should be credited to Karl Kraus. Decades later W. H. Auden also used the expression, but Auden credited Kraus.

Below is an overview tracing the evolution of the saying with variants, attributions, and dates:

1870: Language is the handmaiden of thought
Article in Harper’s New Monthly Magazine; author not specified

1907: For speech is the handmaiden of thought, And thought makes the universe to tremble
Written by Francis du Bosque

1909: Die Sprache ist die Mutter, nicht die Magd des Gedankens
(Language is the mother, not the handmaiden of thought)
Aphorism authored by Karl Kraus

1912: Language is … the mother of thought, not its handmaiden
Credited to Karl Kraus in “The Times Literary Supplement”

1965: Die Sprache ist die Mutter, nicht die Magd, des Gedankens
Epigraph of a poem by W. H. Auden who credited Karl Kraus

1966: Speech is the mistress, not the handmaiden, of thought
Spoken by W. H. Auden during an interview

1970 Jan: Language is the mother, not the handmaiden, of thought; words will tell you things you never thought or felt before
Spoken by W. H. Auden during an interview

1970 Sep: Speech is the mother of thought, not the hand-maiden
Spoken by W. H. Auden during an interview

1988: Language is not the handmaiden but the mother of ideas
Attributed to Karl Kraus

Below are details for selected citations in chronological order.