Quote Investigator® – Page 34

The Only Way of Discovering the Limits of the Possible Is To Venture a Little Way Past Them Into the Impossible

Arthur C. Clarke? Tobias Dantzig? Robert Heinlein? Jerome Agel? Harold Faber? Apocryphal?

Dear Quote Investigator: The science fiction luminary Arthur C. Clarke once said something like: the best way to find the limits of the possible is to go beyond them into the impossible. I have seen several different versions of this remark. Would you please help me to find the correct phrasing together with a citation?

Quote Investigator: Arthur C. Clarke published at least three different versions of this statement. The earliest match known to QI appeared in his 1962 book “Profiles of the Future” within chapter 2 called “Hazards of Prophecy: The Failure of Imagination”.

Clarke presented a table with two columns labeled “The Unexpected” and “The Expected”. The first column on the right listed unforeseen discoveries such as X-rays, transistors, superconductors, and relativity. The second column on the left listed notions that have been envisioned for hundreds or thousands of years such as flying machines, robots, immortality, invisibility, and telepathy. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1]1967 (First publication 1962), Profiles of the Future by Arthur C. Clarke, Chapter 2: Hazards of Prophecy: The Failure of Imagination, Quote Page 20 and 21, Bantam Books, New York. (Verified with … Continue reading

The right-hand list is deliberately provocative; it includes sheer fantasy as well as serious scientific speculation. But the only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.

Previously, the Quote Investigator examined a thematically related adage: “It always seems impossible until it’s done”. The article about this adage is available here.

Below are selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “The Only Way of Discovering the Limits of the Possible Is To Venture a Little Way Past Them Into the Impossible”

References

References
↑1	1967 (First publication 1962), Profiles of the Future by Arthur C. Clarke, Chapter 2: Hazards of Prophecy: The Failure of Imagination, Quote Page 20 and 21, Bantam Books, New York. (Verified with scans)

Quote Origin: There Are Three Kinds of Lies: Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics

Mark Twain? Benjamin Disraeli? St. Swithin? Eliza Gutch? Charles Dilke? Charles Stewart Parnell? Robert Giffen? Arthur James Balfour? Francis Bacon? Anonymous?

**Illustration depicting statistical information from Pixabay**

Question for Quote Investigator: Statistical analysis can provide deep insights into an issue. Yet, carelessness or duplicity can generate misleading results. A popular cynical adage communicates this mistrust:

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

These words have been attributed to prominent humorist Mark Twain, British statesman Benjamin Disraeli, and others. Do you know who should receive credit? Would you please explore this topic?

Reply from Quote Investigator: Mark Twain did include this saying in an installment of his autobiography which he published in 1907; however, he did not claim to be the originator; instead, Twain credited Benjamin Disraeli. Yet, there is no substantive evidence that Disraeli crafted this remark. He died in 1881, and the remark was attributed to him posthumously by 1895.

Tracing this saying is a complex task because the expression evolved over time. Changes were incremental, and there was no single originator who deserved credit. Here is an overview showing key phrases, dates, and attributions.

1882 Apr 04: three classes—liars, great liars, and scientific witnesses (Attributed to “well-known Judge”)

1885 Jun 27: three sorts of liars, the common or garden liar … the damnable liar … and lastly the expert (Attributed to “counsel”)

1885 Nov 26: grouped witnesses into three classes: simple liars, damned liars, and experts (Attributed to “well-known lawyer”)

1886 Apr 10: three kinds of liars who testify in courts: “Lawyers, liars and experts” (Attributed to “distinguished judge”)

1889 Aug 12: There are liars, and d—-d liars and experts (Attributed to “eminent judge”)

1891 Jun 13: three kinds of falsehood: the first is a ‘fib,’ the second is a downright lie, and the third and most aggravated is statistics (Anonymous)

1891 Oct 10: There are three degrees of falsehood: the first is a fib, the second is a lie, and then come statistics (Anonymous)

1891 Oct 14: there were three degrees of untruth—a fib, a lie, and statistics (Charles Dilke)

1891 Oct 19: false statements might be arranged according to their degree under three heads, fibs, lies, and statistics. (Attributed to Charles Dilke)

1891 Oct 28: Mr. Parnell’s dictum respecting fibs, lies, and statistics (Attributed to Charles Stewart Parnell)

1891 Nov 07: classifies falsehood under three heads: 1, the fib; 2, the lie; 3, statistics (Attributed to Mark Twain)

1892: three degrees of unveracity—“Lies, d——d lies, and statistics.” (Attributed to “some wit”)

1892 Jan: There are lies, there are outrageous lies, and there are statistics (Anonymous)

1892 Feb: three degrees in liars: the liar simple, the d — d liar, and the expert witness (Anonymous)

1892 Jun 28: three kinds of unveracity—namely, lies, damned lies, and statistics (Arthur James Balfour)

1895 July 27: three degrees of veracity—viz., lies d—d lies, and statistics (Attributed to Lord Beaconsfield, i.e., Benjamin Disraeli)

1907 Jul 5: There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics (Attributed to Benjamin Disraeli by Mark Twain)

QI gives great thanks to previous researchers particularly Stephen Goranson and Peter M. Lee who located many of the citations mentioned above.

Below are selected citations in chronological order.

I Had the Syrup But It Wouldn’t Pour

Gertrude Stein? Alice B. Toklas? Glenway Wescott? William Styron? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: Whenever I experience difficulty in a creative endeavor like writing or drawing I am reminded of the following expression:

I have the syrup, but it won’t pour.

The prize-winning author William Styron said something similar to this. Would you please help me to find a citation?

Quote Investigator: In 1933 prominent novelist and art collector Gertrude Stein published “The Autobiography of Alice B. Toklas”. Stein’s book adopted the viewpoint and voice of her friend and life partner Toklas, but Stein was the ultimate author. The work briefly remarked on two contemporary authors. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1] 1933, The Autobiography of Alice B. Toklas by Gertrude Stein, Chapter 7: After the War 1919-1932, Quote Page 269, Harcourt, Brace and Company, New York. (Verified with scans)

Then there was McAlmon. McAlmon had one quality that appealed to Gertrude Stein, abundance, he could go on writing, but she complained that it was dull.

There was also Glenway Wescott but Glenway Wescott at no time interested Gertrude Stein. He has a certain syrup but it does not pour.

In 1979 William Styron published “Sophie’s Choice”, and a character in the novel referred back to Stein’s words while describing his difficulties:^[2] 1979, Sophie’s Choice by William Styron, Chapter 1, Quote Page 3, Jonathan Cape, London. (Verified with scans)

It was not that I no longer wanted to write, I still yearned passionately to produce the novel which had been for so long captive in my brain. It was only that, having written down the first few fine paragraphs, I could not produce any others, or—to approximate Gertrude Stein’s remark about a lesser writer of the Lost Generation—I had the syrup but it wouldn’t pour. To make matters worse, I was out of a job and had very little money and was self-exiled to Flatbush . . .

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “I Had the Syrup But It Wouldn’t Pour”

References

References
↑1	1933, The Autobiography of Alice B. Toklas by Gertrude Stein, Chapter 7: After the War 1919-1932, Quote Page 269, Harcourt, Brace and Company, New York. (Verified with scans)
↑2	1979, Sophie’s Choice by William Styron, Chapter 1, Quote Page 3, Jonathan Cape, London. (Verified with scans)

Quote Origin: The Sea Is the Sea. The Old Man Is an Old Man

Ernest Hemingway? Bernard Berenson? Apocryphal?

Question for Quote Investigator: Ernest Hemingway’s classic novella “The Old Man and the Sea” has been exhaustively analyzed by critics and commentators. Beleaguered high school students have been coerced into composing essays about the tale. Unsurprisingly, the story has been transformed into a cornucopia for symbol generation.

Yet, Hemingway himself apparently believed that there were no symbols in his fable. He stated that “the old man is an old man”. Would you please help me to find a citation?

Reply from Quote Investigator: In September 1952 Ernest Hemingway sent a letter to Renaissance art specialist Bernard Berenson. Hemingway commented on the lack of intentional symbolism in “The Old Man and the Sea”. The letter was reprinted in the collection “Ernest Hemingway Selected Letters 1917-1961”. The collection editor noted that the famous author used an irregular spelling for “symbolism”. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:¹

Then there is the other secret. There isn’t any symbolysm (mis-spelled). The sea is the sea. The old man is an old man. The boy is a boy and the fish is a fish. The shark are all sharks no better and no worse. All the symbolism that people say is shit. What goes beyond is what you see beyond when you know. A writer should know too much.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

People Will Not Say Anymore That the Greeks Fight Like Heroes But Heroes Fight Like Greeks

Winston Churchill? Demetrius Caclamanos? John Rupert Colville? Queen Frederika of Greece? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: A family of statements highlights the valor of military forces. Here are two examples:

Henceforth we will not say that Greeks fight like heroes, but that heroes fight like Greeks

Finns don’t fight like heroes; heroes fight like Finns

These sayings use a rhetorical technique called antimetabole in which clauses are repeated while keywords are transposed. The first statement above has often been attributed to statesman Winston Churchill, but I am skeptical because I have not seen a solid citation. Would you please explore this topic?

Quote Investigator: The earliest match located by QI appeared in “The Manchester Guardian” of England in April 1941 within an article by Greek diplomat Demetrius Caclamanos. Boldface added to excepts by QI:^[1] 1941 April 18, The Manchester Guardian, The Campaign in Greece by Demetrius Caclamanos (former Greek Minister to Britain), Start Page 4, Quote Page 6, Column 2, Manchester, England. (Newspapers_com)

It was rightly said that “people will not say any more that the Greeks fight like heroes but heroes fight like Greeks.”

Caclamanos’s article discussed the attack on Greece by the forces of Italy and Germany during World War II in 1940 and 1941. Greek forces were initially able to repulse the attacks although the country was ultimately conquered by the Axis powers. The phrasing above signaled that Caclamanos was disclaiming credit for the quotation. Based on current evidence QI believes that the authorship of the saying remains anonymous.

The saying was attributed to Winston Churchill by 1951, but that late date meant the evidence was weak. See the 1951 citation presented further below.

Richard Langworth who is the top expert on Winston Churchill quotations has examined this topic in a posting on his website. Langworth searched a massive digital corpus containing millions of words written by and about Churchill, but he did not find evidence supporting the ascription. Langworth stated “It’s rather good, but I cannot track that quotation”.^[2]Website: Richard Langworth, Article title: “Greeks Fight Like Heroes – Heroes Fight Like Greeks”: Not By Churchill, Article author: Richard Langworth, Date on website: November 5, 2021, Website … Continue reading

Here are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “People Will Not Say Anymore That the Greeks Fight Like Heroes But Heroes Fight Like Greeks”

References

References
↑1	1941 April 18, The Manchester Guardian, The Campaign in Greece by Demetrius Caclamanos (former Greek Minister to Britain), Start Page 4, Quote Page 6, Column 2, Manchester, England. (Newspapers_com)
↑2	Website: Richard Langworth, Article title: “Greeks Fight Like Heroes – Heroes Fight Like Greeks”: Not By Churchill, Article author: Richard Langworth, Date on website: November 5, 2021, Website description: Discussion of quotations correctly and incorrectly attributed to Winston Churchill. (Accessed richardlangworth.com on June 14, 2022) link

Damn Everything But the Circus! Damn Everything That Is Grim, Dull, Motionless, Unrisking, Inward Turning

E. E. Cummings? Corita Kent? Helen Kelley? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: To enjoy a full life one must be willing to embrace excitement, change, beauty, and risk. Metaphorically, one must enter the center ring of life’s circus and perform. The prominent U.S. poet E. E. Cummings (often styled e e cummings) has been credited with a pertinent passage:

Damn everything but the circus! . . . damn everything that is grim, dull, motionless, unrisking, inward turning, damn everything that won’t get into the circle, that won’t enjoy. That won’t throw it’s heart into the tension, surprise, fear and delight of the circus, the round world, the full existence.

I think this attribution is inaccurate because I have never been able to find a solid citation. Would you please help me to find the true author?

Quote Investigator: QI believes the passage under examination is a composite. The first line was extracted from a dialog written by E. E. Cummings, and the remainder was created by Sister Helen Kelley who was President of Immaculate Heart College of Los Angeles, California from 1963 to 1977.

In 1927 E. E. Cummings published a play titled “Him” in the literary journal “Dial”. The work included the following exchange between characters named “Him” and “Me”. Cumming’s text combined some words, e.g., “circus tent” appeared as “circustent”. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1]1927 August, Dial: A Semi-monthly Journal of Literary Criticism, Discussion, and Information, Him by E. E. Cummings, Act 1, Scene 2, Start Page 101, Quote Page 105 and 106, Chicago, Illinois. … Continue reading

HIM: (Vehemently) Damn everything but the circus! (To himself ) And here am I, patiently squeezing fourdimensional ideas into a twodimensional stage, when all of me that’s any one or anything is in the top of a circustent . . . ( A pause.)

ME: I didn’t imagine you were leading a double life—and right under my nose, too.

HIM: ( Unhearing, proceeds contemptuously ) : The average “painter” “sculptor” “poet” “composer” “playwright” is a person who cannot leap through a hoop from the back of a galloping horse, make people laugh with a clown’s mouth, orchestrate twenty lions.

Here are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “Damn Everything But the Circus! Damn Everything That Is Grim, Dull, Motionless, Unrisking, Inward Turning”

References

References
↑1	1927 August, Dial: A Semi-monthly Journal of Literary Criticism, Discussion, and Information, Him by E. E. Cummings, Act 1, Scene 2, Start Page 101, Quote Page 105 and 106, Chicago, Illinois. (ProQuest)

Always Do Sober What You Said You’d Do Drunk. That Will Teach You To Keep Your Mouth Shut

Ernest Hemingway? Charles Scribner IV? Malcolm Forbes? Apocryphal?

Dear Quote Investigator: The prominent U.S. writer Ernest Hemingway once described a strategy to reduce drunken boasting. The inebriated person should wait until soberness returns and then perform the foolish boastful actions. Thus, one will quickly learn to keep one’s mouth shut. Is this genuine advice from Hemingway? Would you please help me to find a citation?

Quote Investigator: The earliest match for this tale located by QI appeared in “Forbes” magazine in September 1961. The editor Malcolm S. Forbes wrote the following. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1]1961 September 1, Forbes, Volume 88, Issue 5, Fact and Comment by Malcolm S. Forbes, Sub-section: One of Hemingway’s “Rules for Living”, Start Page 7, Quote Page 8, Forbes Inc., New York. … Continue reading

When Charles Scribner (IV) succeeded his late father as head of the country’s most venerable publishing firm in 1952, Ernest Hemingway, an old friend, wrote him a long personal letter, which concluded with a list of his “rules for life.” Among them, this one which we pass on to our readers without further comment:

“Always do sober what you said you’d do drunk: That will teach you to keep your mouth shut.”

Forbes did not explain how he learned about the content of Hemingway’s letter. Perhaps Scribner recounted the story to Forbes.

Additional strong evidence supporting the authenticity of the remark appeared in a book Scribner authored in 1990. He presented the same tale and a longer version of the quotation with the phrase “do when you were drunk”. Details are given further below.

Here are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “Always Do Sober What You Said You’d Do Drunk. That Will Teach You To Keep Your Mouth Shut”

References

References
↑1	1961 September 1, Forbes, Volume 88, Issue 5, Fact and Comment by Malcolm S. Forbes, Sub-section: One of Hemingway’s “Rules for Living”, Start Page 7, Quote Page 8, Forbes Inc., New York. (Verified with scans)

There Isn’t Anyone You Couldn’t Love Once You’ve Heard Their Story

Fred Rogers? Mister Rogers? Joanne Rogers? Mary Lou Kownacki? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: One empathetic thinker suggested that it was possible to love almost anyone once one heard their full story. This notion has been attributed to U.S. television host Fred Rogers who was best known by the appellation “Mister Rogers”, but I have been unable to find a solid citation. Would you please explore this topic?

Quote Investigator: The earliest strong match located by QI appeared in the 1994 book “More Random Acts of Kindness” by the editors of Conari Press of Berkeley, California. This work contained inspirational stories of kindness together with many quotations such as following. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1] 1994, More Random Acts of Kindness by The Editors of Conari Press, Quote Page 75, Conari Press, Berkeley, California. (Verified with scans)

Engrave this upon my heart: There isn’t anyone you couldn’t love once you’ve heard their story.
—Mary Lou Kownacki, OSB

The “OSB” designation signaled Kownacki’s membership in the Order of St. Benedict, a monastic religious order of the Roman Catholic Church. She is the leading candidate for originator of this expression.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “There Isn’t Anyone You Couldn’t Love Once You’ve Heard Their Story”

References

References
↑1	1994, More Random Acts of Kindness by The Editors of Conari Press, Quote Page 75, Conari Press, Berkeley, California. (Verified with scans)

There Are Old Traders and Bold Traders, But There Are No Old, Bold Traders

Bob Dinda? Tom Clapp? Jerry Heaster? W. Thomas Matthews? Ed Seykota? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: Engaging in risky trades of financial instruments endangers one’s financial health. A Wall Street adage states:

There are old traders and bold traders, but there are no old, bold traders.

Would you please explore the provenance of this saying?

Quote Investigator: The earliest match located by QI appeared in August 1982 within a newspaper column written by Tom Clapp of the financial services firm Edward D. Jones & Company. Clapp did not claim credit:^[1] 1982 August 16, The Alliance Times-Herald, Financial Focus, Quote Page 8, Column 3, Alliance, Nebraska. (Newspapers_com)

Quote for the week: “There are old traders around and bold traders, but there are no old, bold traders around.” — Bob Dinda

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “There Are Old Traders and Bold Traders, But There Are No Old, Bold Traders”

References

References
↑1	1982 August 16, The Alliance Times-Herald, Financial Focus, Quote Page 8, Column 3, Alliance, Nebraska. (Newspapers_com)

There Are Old Pilots, and There Are Bold Pilots, But There Are No Old, Bold Pilots

Dorothy Verrill? Charles L. Wright? Harry D. Copland? Harry Copewell? Anonymous?

Dear Quote Investigator: The adjective “bold” has positive connotations. Yet, some difficult and dangerous professions do not countenance the inherent riskiness of bold actions. Here is the template of a pertinent adage:

There are old X, and there are bold X, but there are no old bold X.

This saying has been applied to race car drivers, mushroom hunters, airplane pilots, stock traders, and others. Would you please explore this topic?

Quote Investigator: The earliest instance in this family of expressions located by QI appeared in “Safety Education: A Magazine of the Good Adventure” in May 1931. Airplane pilot Dorothy Verrill wrote about her experiences learning to fly. Boldface added to excerpts by QI:^[1]1931 May, Safety Education: A Magazine of the Good Adventure, How Good Pilots Are Made by Dorothy Verrill, Start Page 231, Quote Page 231, Column 1, Education Division of the National Safety Council, … Continue reading

“There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots” said my instructor, one day, after we had come down from practising landings, “and it’s not a good idea to make a climbing turn at low altitude right after the take-off, as you did just now. It may be pretty flying, and it may be exciting—give you a thrill—but it’s not safe, especially for a student.”

Dorothy Verrill ascribed the saying to her flight instructor. QI examined articles in “The Hartford Courant” of Connecticut^[2] 1929 February 20, The Hartford Courant, Aviation by Mary Goodrich, Quote Page 6, Column 7, Hartford, Connecticut. (Newspapers_com) and “The Kansas City Star” of Missouri^[3]1929 March 31, The Kansas City Star, A Woman’s Temper Defeats Mental Hazards in Flying by Dorothy Verrill Yates, (North American Newspaper Alliance), Quote Page 17A, Column 3, Kansas City, … Continue reading which identified Lieutenant Charles L. Wright of the L & H Aircraft Corporation as Verrill’s instructor. Thus, Wright is currently one of the leading candidates for creator of this expression.

Below are additional selected citations in chronological order.

Continue reading “There Are Old Pilots, and There Are Bold Pilots, But There Are No Old, Bold Pilots”

References

References
↑1	1931 May, Safety Education: A Magazine of the Good Adventure, How Good Pilots Are Made by Dorothy Verrill, Start Page 231, Quote Page 231, Column 1, Education Division of the National Safety Council, New York. (Verified with scans; thanks to University of Minnesota Library System)
↑2	1929 February 20, The Hartford Courant, Aviation by Mary Goodrich, Quote Page 6, Column 7, Hartford, Connecticut. (Newspapers_com)
↑3	1929 March 31, The Kansas City Star, A Woman’s Temper Defeats Mental Hazards in Flying by Dorothy Verrill Yates, (North American Newspaper Alliance), Quote Page 17A, Column 3, Kansas City, Missouri. (Newspapers_com)